Sunday, April 04, 2010

MBS Spanko Brunch #220

Happy Easter. Happy Passover. Happy Equinox. Happy Spring. Happy weekend. Happy spankings!

Our topic this week is based upon a question I have received from (often anonymous) e-mailers several times in various forms over the years. The basic theme is that the sender has a difficult time believing that any intelligent, capable adult woman would allow herself to be subjected to repeated spankings. The implication is that I must either have mental health issues or be a battered wife. Of course, neither is true. If they seem earnest, I write back and try to explain this, but I doubt I change anyone's mind.

Why is it so difficult for many vanillas to accept that there are successful, sane, happy people who find consensual adult spankings to be beneficial?

If you would like to join our conversation, just enter a comment below. Once everyone has had their fair chance to speak, I will post an edited summary.


RPT (Fred Bloggs) said...

Supposedly sane people do many strange activities that are considered quite normal in society. Smoking cigarettes for example.

It's the context within society that makes people think spanking is weird but inhaling toxic fumes is OK.

Spanking is not "mainstream". Perhaps we need to change that!

morningstar said...

i have come to the conclusion over my years of spankings and D/s .. being owned .. all of it....... that:

1) it is the way i am hot wired and there is nothing i can do about

2) there is absolutely no point in trying to explain to someone who is not wired the same way why i crave/need spankings .....

Trying to explain the spanking scenario to vanillas is a bit like when i was working at the Blind School and i had a child ask me to describe the sky...

i said it is "blue" and he asked "what is blue?"

It just can't be done.

Pointe Finale.


Elysia said...

My children love Sponge Bob Square Pants cartoons. There is an episode where Sponge Bob finds out that his fellow employee Squidward has never tried a crabby patty which is the main product that they sell at the Crusty Crab fast food restaurant where they both work. Squidward is adamant that he would find them awful. Sponge Bob tells him that "The only people who don't like crabby patties, have never tasted one!" Needless to say that Squidward becomes addicted after just one bit.
My advice to the e-mailers, would be "Try it! You'll like it!" or perhaps, "Don't knock it till you tried it!"

Rob said...

I frequently wrestle with this in my own mind, (as a male on the receiving end) so it is not hard for me to believe that others would see this as strange or abusive. My spouse and I just had this conversation a few weeks ago as she was asking me what I get out of spankings. I tried to explain that it's just always been a fascination of mine. As Morningstar said, I'm just wired that way. I may not be able to make my spouse fully understand, but she does see it as a need that I have and thankfully she's willing to explore it with me.

sixofthebest said...

To me Bonnie, spanking a naughty mature woman on the bare bottom wearing garter-belt and stockings, is a sexual fetish. All these items mentioned by me, are my own personal and most enjoyable preferances. Plus using the cane on her delectable naked bottom.

Anonymous said...

It's like trying to explain why a fish needs to swim, or why an artist needs to paint.. I hope one day my husband understands this. I'm dying to be turned over his knee. :) I've tried to explain this to him many times. I guess if you aren't wired this way, it's difficult to comprehend. To the original comment, Bonnie posted, that person must get some gratification from making themselves feel superior to others. Why else would the sit in judgement of others.? Furthermore, he/she must have have this desire and be unwilling to pursue it because he/she doesn't consider it to be mainstream. Why would that person sit in judgement if that individual is checking out your website in the first place? It's kind of like going to church and announcing to the faithful congregation that you don't believe in God.

Keagen said...

Awesome topic, Bonnie!

I believe that the issue with most "vanillas" lies in the connotation. There are two things that IMMEDIATELY jump to mind for most vanillas, and that is the extreme form of BDSM that is popularized by the media and internet, and domestic violence.

First, there is pain and power play, they assume, being exchanged as people "enjoy" it. Now, I know we look at that and go, "So what?" To them, though, the most vivid and extreme example of BDSM come to mind. . . . It's all they've been exposed to.

On the second count, there is pain, hitting, crying, and in some cases, large amounts of control being exchanged. When those are the only known elements (beyond the loving, caring, supportive relationship behind it), it can look really scary, especially if it's a close friend or family member.

They're judging our actions and words, I believe, by what they know. That's the common human measuring stick, unfortunately, and the connotation is that it's either "extremely weird" or "extremely abusive".

We are wired this way, and the relationships most of us are involved in aren't problematic in the slightest sense. . . . but when viewed through a lens, it definitely can appear so.

(LOL..... I just HAVE to add this in. My verification code to post this comment is "No Lovin" *grins* Ironic.)

Hermione said...

I think the perception of violence and physical abuse is what comes first to the mind of most vanillas. Why would someone want to be hurt? Coupled with the inherent humiliation of baring one's bottom and assuming humiliating positions, it's no wonder they think we are either crazy, unbalanced or just plain nuts. I don't think we can change a vanilla's way of looking at us or convince one that we not only like it, we love and crave it. It's simply a fact that we are made that way, and they aren't.

I do think it is possible for a vanilla to learn to enjoy spanking or being spanked - especially if their partner is a spanko and wants them to play the desired other role - but that would come from actually experiencing it, not just talking about it.

Anonymous said...

I think that an admirable fear of hurting women is partly at the core of vanilla outrage about spanking. Also, I think people tend to feel they have to speak out strongly against fetishes (I hate calling it a fetish) that are not their own. I think that is a great shame and reminds me of the school yard where one had to seperate oneself from any group that one was not in.

I think of Yeats' line from "He wishes for the cloths of Heaven." when I speak of other people's desires. "Tread softly for you tread on my dreams."
Except I only do this as long as everyone is consenting, maybe vanilla people are concerned or could not imagine that there could be consent. That is why I would try to respond calmly and gently to any concerns.
I don't want to convert anyone to anything and if they speak from a wish that we are all safe and happy then there is no cause for righteous anger.

sunflower said...

There are several reasons why I think it is hard for "vanillas" to accept- one is that humans are hardwired to avoid pain. For those who don't understand the sensual nature of pain because they aren't wired that way, that an adult would willingly seek out and embrace pain is strange. Also, the common idea of spanking is that of a parent chastising a wayward child. Again, this makes it hard for those who don't understand to grasp why it's pleasurable. I don't think they're being judgemental they just can't fathom because they aren't wired that way. It's like broccoli- either you like it or you don't. There's nothing wrong or right about broccoli but some people just can't eat it, some love it. Same with adult spanking, I think.

Anonymous said...

You know, although I am terribly masochist and quite submissive myself, (and quite sane, it seems, and definitely very strong) I do have the same prejudice. When I see women being treated badly, in clubs, or at parties, I always think they must be psycho, or weak, or what. It's the strangest thing!
The internet seems very useful in that account. By reading stuff like yours, Bonnie, or even Kaya's much tougher blog, I am understanding a little better.

Happy Easter! Tina

Mark said...

People are wired to seek pleasure and avoid pain. To most normal people, spanking causes pain and is therefore to be avoided. Heck, the way my wife wields a hairbrush I agree with them. But they don't see or understand the psychological aspects which dominate the physical aspects. For those with the spanko gene, to avoid the (physical) pain would just cause greater (emotional) pain.

We like to be spanked because the entire experience is not defined simply by the stroke of the implement and the pain it causes.

Of course, there are those who just like to take the pain, but they are real freaks...just kidding...

Mary said...

I think it is hard because for some it is just so far from what they could imagine that it just seems like there must be something wrong.

Anonymous said...

An unusual Easter tradition... I wonder what vanillas think about Dyngus Day? This occurs the Monday after Easter. This is a Czech and Polish tradition. The men spank women with whips and switches on the Monday after Easter. The women can get even with the men by pouring buckets of ice water on them later.

sixofthebest said...

I'll tell you a little secret Bonnie. As a whole, the 'spanking community', has a very high INTELLIGENCE QUOTIENT, namely [I.Q.] amongst its followers. Would'nt you agree on that Bonnie.

Spank-A-Lot said...

Well as the saying goes "one man's food is another man's poison".

I am sure there are tons of reasons why vanillas or the "unconverted" shiver in such horror when faced with spankos like us. Of course I am sure some were due to probable bad experiences. But I still strong believe that inside every human is that hint of spanko-ism just waiting to be unleashed. And assuming that is the case, then I guess the shivers of horror and ghastly faces from all vanillas are merely just a normal reaction to the "unknown". A normal reaction that I for example gave the first time my mother asked me to try chicken feet (I am Singaporean and Chinese). But after I tasted it, I fell in love. So to all vanillas out there.........dun write it off if you haven't tried don't know what ya missing!!!!!

Bonnie said...

I have no desire to promote this activity to anyone who is not already interested. One can ask why anyone without at least some curiosity would visit this blog. But I am certain it does happen. Think, for example, about Keyword Chaos. Many of those people were not looking for information about consensual adult spanking, but through the shifting winds of the internet, landed here anyway.

When these lost cyber-tourists stop at MBS, I have an opportunity to speak to them and occasionally with them. My message is not, “Spanking is cool and you should grab your partner and start paddling right now.” I recognize that won't register with true vanillas. My message instead is, “We're really not weird or scary or dangerous. We're positive, sane, caring people who choose express our love through spanking.”

Other minorities have worked for decades or even centuries to gain acceptance within society. This is the path we walk as well. For the moment, however, my aspirations are more modest. I have no intention of telling friends from the office that my husband spanks me. But should they ever find out, I don't want to be shunned or ridiculed.

Spanking is my choice. Each time I drape myself across Randy's lap, it's because I want to be there. Spanking enthusiasts are a community. I stand with them because we share common interests and goals. Vanillas are not our enemy. The foes we face are ignorance, misinformation, and stereotypes.

I look forward to a day when spanking is considered like, say, fellatio. Not all lovers practice this technique, but it's common enough that few people think much one way or the other about those who partake.

Daisychain said...

I think it's difficult for them to accept because it is like a fear of the unknown...
I don't consider it a fetish, just a different way of expressing love and utter trust.
There are many ways of expressing love; as Bonnie said, oral sex is one way; not all participate, and of those who do, not all enjoy, yet it is not considered a fetish by those who don't. Some have a penchant for feet, toe sucking etc; different people just get turned on by different things.
When you hear others talking about their nights of passion, you sometimes cringe in horror/embarrassment, for you don't do THAT! It doesn't make it wrong!
However, I am sure there must be a link between abuse and spanking in the eyes of the uninitiated... and there probably always will be, however much we deny it..its just a lack of understanding, and we should pity them, for we know what they are missing!

R Humphries said...

Hi Guys … Another great question … As a lifelong dedicated spanko my view of this subject might seem rather surprising … I spent a considerable period of my early life in a very loving and successful vanilla relationship … to my former partners credit when I explained my predilection she did willingly (I use that term rather loosely) indulge me and experiment … but it was clear that she did not and never would ‘get it’ or gain any pleasure from being spanked, she simply could not understand the concept of deriving pleasure, sensual or otherwise, at either imparting or receiving pain which was her perception/interpretation of spanking … I saw no virtue in trying to ‘convert’ her.

Personally I have never felt the need to discuss Jojo and I’s intimate life-style at vanilla dinner parties or for the most part with anybody outside the spanking community but if I did I think in all likelihood most of our friends would just roll their eyes and laugh … in general I have never really encountered any ‘anti adult-spanking’ crusaders … but to be honest despite my own preference I can actually understand (not agree or sympathize) the subjective viewpoint that could be taken by observers of either genre with regard to spanking activities as described in the question Bonnie posed … but in my case life is just too short to kvetch over how outsiders perceive Jojo and I’s chosen lifestyle … we like it, we understand it and that’s good enough for me … Cheers … RH


I think that the first thing that people who ask questions like that need pointing out to them is how sexist they are being by singling out women from the spankee group. When made to think of men and women together, they can at least have "Battered wife" removed from the equation.

As for the question itself, I don't think that there is any reason why they should understand it. There are many fetishes that I don't understand, desperation/pee fetishes for example. All that I have to know about these fetishes and all that vanillas need to know about adult spanking is that it is safe, consensual and is not going to be imposed on them if they do not want it to be.


Zille Defeu said...

I was just talking the other day with a friend about how “vanillas” are often so ready to accept a bit of spanky-bot-bot as normal foreplay, how so many of them have a pair of handcuffs or a silk scarf in the bedside drawer, and it is so easy for them to accept that as a bit of harmless fun. Kind of in the way a completely straight girl could be perfectly comfortable in a room full of naked gals, in a way that a bi or lesbian woman is no longer able to be entirely comfortable, but has to avert her eyes or she feels like she’s ogling.

(So I think that the comparison of spanking with fellatio is actually more reasonable than you may think – it’s just that you are getting emails from the sorts of people who might think fellatio is also sick and not part of a healthy sex life!)

So one does wonder if all of those people who refuse to believe that “any intelligent, capable adult woman would allow herself to be subjected to repeated spankings” are closeted spankos (or other kinky type) who cannot accept in others what they refuse to allow in themselves.

Another point, however, is that vanillas tend to understand a bit of spanking as a part of sex. But if you are completely satisfied and fulfilled by spanking, that strikes them as weird. (There’s your “mental health issues”!) And if you are using spanking for behaviour modification, well, that’s just sick and wrong, obviously. (And there’s the “battered wife”!)

If you are going to be able to explain it to vanillas at all, I’ve found the best thing is to compare it to a “runner’s high.” Runners and other exercisers will go through all sorts of pain (The first day back at the gym can be more painful than the average spanking!) for a variety of “understandable” reasons, like the release of adrenalin and endorphins which make you feel so good after the pain/exertion is over. Or the “results,” which are physical for gym-goers and more emotional for spankees. But even a good workout can leave you feeling centred and calmed, the way a spanking does.

But the people who are repressed you can never get to accept “beneficial consensual adult spankings.” And most unrepressed vanillas will never “get it” outside of a sexual context.

(Not that spankings don’t have their place in said sexual context! Never let it be said that I am against mixing spanking and sex!) [grins]

Rob of NYC said...

There is a difference between fellatio and spanking. Spanking can be and has been used abusively. Non-consensual spanking clearly is abusive. However, when it's mutually consensual the equation completely changes. And that is what needs to be stressed. I have told two friends. Never again. No more explaining that I am not the slightest bit violent. I don't use spanking for punishment (not into it, others are), or do anything related to spanking that is not fully consensual. Since I don't feel like explaining what I do, I refrain from discussing it in the first place. Live and learn.

Love4her said...

Why can some not understand that the house does not need to be spotless? How can one not fold their underwear in the drawer? How can some people not like black coffee? Why can’t some people ever seem to hit the laundry basket with their dirty clothes?

There are many questions in life and why one can not understand another’s need for a sound spanking can be one of them, especially if the one desiring is mated to a non spanko. There are also huge sexual and power play overtones with spanking that really force the giver and the receiver to examine their roles in the exchange. That examination is difficult because some just don’t think of sex, including spankings and other kinks, as something playful in the sense of loose boundaries and rules and they operate within pretty strict limits as to what is “normal” or we might say “vanilla/”

On another blog someplace the question of the day is......

Why is it so difficult for a kinky mate to accept that there are successful, sane, happy people who simply have no interest, see no point, no need and find no pleasure or satisfaction in (fill in the blank) spanking another or being spanked? Why can they not accept that this position too is normal?

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